Author Topic: Medway - Chatham bus lane - TPT state "...the contravention did not occur"  (Read 5957 times)

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Offline EDW2000

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Re: Medway - Chatham bus lane - TPT state "...the contravention did not occur"
« Reply #15 on: 14 January, 2013, 09:30:33 AM »
Look at the advance warning sign - cycle, local bus, taxi,


now look at the bus station sign - local bus, taxi.


So cycles not allowed in bus station, but there are two signs saying cycle lane.

« Last Edit: 14 January, 2013, 09:33:16 AM by EDW2000 »

Offline beanz

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Re: Medway - Chatham bus lane - TPT state "...the contravention did not occur"
« Reply #16 on: 16 January, 2013, 11:16:29 AM »
Hi all,

I have just received a PCN from Medway Council for a bus lane contravention from 27/12/2012 when i entered Globe Lane from Medway Street, it's the first time I had driven in Chatham in ages and I was trying to get from Staples to the Historic Dockyard when I used this route, can I use the findings of the TCT's listed above in my fight against the PCN????

Thanks in advance. :( :( :(

Offline The Bald Eagle

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Re: Medway - Chatham bus lane - TPT state "...the contravention did not occur"
« Reply #17 on: 16 January, 2013, 12:16:31 PM »
Hi all,

I have just received a PCN from Medway Council for a bus lane contravention from 27/12/2012 when i entered Globe Lane from Medway Street, it's the first time I had driven in Chatham in ages and I was trying to get from Staples to the Historic Dockyard when I used this route, can I use the findings of the TCT's listed above in my fight against the PCN????

Thanks in advance. :( :( :(


Take a look at my letter to the council on this thread beanz.

http://notomob.co.uk/discussions/index.php/topic,2567.0.html

You will see I quote three cases (Willson, Child and New) and that they cover the approach to Globe lane from two different directions.

In my opinion no one here could or should advise you as to what evidence you could or should be presenting to the TPT. What cannot be condoned are persons who take these cases as an excuse to use the bus lane with impunity.

However, if it is a genuine mistake and a one off... <_>
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Offline EDW2000

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Re: Medway - Chatham bus lane - TPT state "...the contravention did not occur"
« Reply #18 on: 16 January, 2013, 12:37:25 PM »
It seems they are now not contesting some appeals.

A FOI request to find out why might be interesting.



Another sign inadequate case.


Case Number MW 06556J
Page 1 of 1
Adjudicator’s Decision
xxxxxxx
and
Medway Council
Penalty Charge Notice MW99680575 £60.00
Appeal allowed on the ground that the alleged contravention did not
occur.
I direct the Council to cancel the Penalty Charge Notice and Notice to
Owner.
Reasons
This matter came before me as a personal hearing in London on 18th October
2012. The Appellant appeared, together with her husband xxxxxxxxxx, who
was the driver of the vehicle at the relevant time. The Council did not attend. I
therefore considered the matter on the basis of the oral representations of the
Appellant and her witness and the written representations of the Council.
On Friday, 24th February 2012, the Penalty Charge Notice (PCN) was issued by
post to the Appellant in relation to a contravention which is alleged to have
occurred on 19th May 2012 at 10.16 in Globe Lane, Chatham (North Western
Arm) for being in in a Bus Lane.
The evidence is quite clear that the Appellant’s vehicle was in the bus lane. The
basis of the appeal is that the signage was inadequate. I have been provided
with a very lengthy and detailed file in connection with this matter. I have also
drawn to my attention the decisions of my fellow adjudicators, John Parker and
Chris Nicholls, in the case of MW 06548L, the case of Peter Wilson and Medway
Council in relation to a contravention which is alleged to have occurred on 8th
June 2012 which is the same area. I am satisfied from the evidence presented to
me that Mr Horbury, who was driving the vehicle, in fact approached the bus lane
where the contravention is alleged to have occurred from Waterfront Way. In
those circumstances, the case is on identical facts to that decided by Mr Parker
and Mr Nicholls. I am satisfied that everything that Mr Nicholls says in that
Judgement applies in this case and accordingly I am satisfied that the signage
was inadequate and accordingly I allow the Appeal.

Andrew Keenan

Adjudicator 9 November 2012
« Last Edit: 16 January, 2013, 01:00:56 PM by EDW2000 »

Offline The Bald Eagle

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Re: Medway - Chatham bus lane - TPT state "...the contravention did not occur"
« Reply #19 on: 16 January, 2013, 01:30:28 PM »
It seems they are now not contesting some appeals.

A FOI request to find out why might be interesting.



Another sign inadequate case.


Case Number MW 06556J
Page 1 of 1
Adjudicator’s Decision
xxxxxxx
and
Medway Council
Penalty Charge Notice MW99680575 £60.00
Appeal allowed on the ground that the alleged contravention did not
occur.
I direct the Council to cancel the Penalty Charge Notice and Notice to
Owner.
Reasons
This matter came before me as a personal hearing in London on 18th October
2012. The Appellant appeared, together with her husband xxxxxxxxxx, who
was the driver of the vehicle at the relevant time. The Council did not attend. I
therefore considered the matter on the basis of the oral representations of the
Appellant and her witness and the written representations of the Council.
On Friday, 24th February 2012, the Penalty Charge Notice (PCN) was issued by
post to the Appellant in relation to a contravention which is alleged to have
occurred on 19th May 2012 at 10.16 in Globe Lane, Chatham (North Western
Arm) for being in in a Bus Lane.
The evidence is quite clear that the Appellant’s vehicle was in the bus lane. The
basis of the appeal is that the signage was inadequate. I have been provided
with a very lengthy and detailed file in connection with this matter. I have also
drawn to my attention the decisions of my fellow adjudicators, John Parker and
Chris Nicholls, in the case of MW 06548L, the case of Peter Wilson and Medway
Council in relation to a contravention which is alleged to have occurred on 8th
June 2012 which is the same area. I am satisfied from the evidence presented to
me that Mr Horbury, who was driving the vehicle, in fact approached the bus lane
where the contravention is alleged to have occurred from Waterfront Way. In
those circumstances, the case is on identical facts to that decided by Mr Parker
and Mr Nicholls. I am satisfied that everything that Mr Nicholls says in that
Judgement applies in this case and accordingly I am satisfied that the signage
was inadequate and accordingly I allow the Appeal.

Andrew Keenan

Adjudicator 9 November 2012


Where did you get that EDW?
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Offline EDW2000

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Re: Medway - Chatham bus lane - TPT state "...the contravention did not occur"
« Reply #20 on: 16 January, 2013, 03:33:25 PM »
TPT gave it to me because I am preparing case for a punter.

The idea is to go to TPT and ask for costs if he wins
because they know the signs are inadequate.




Dear Sir
 
Thank you for your enquiry.
 
I attach some allowed decisions relating to Globe Lane. If you require any more, we would need  the appellant name or case reference.
 
We do not know when the decisions will be available on-line.
 
Yours sincerely
 
Stuart Wilson
 
Stuart Wilson
Tribunal Information Officer
Traffic Penalty Tribunal
Barlow House
Minshull Street
Manchester
M1 3DZ.
 
Tel : (0161) 242 5286
Fax: (0161) 242 5265

Offline Lizzyp

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Re: Medway - Chatham bus lane - TPT state "...the contravention did not occur"
« Reply #21 on: 22 January, 2013, 08:55:21 PM »
Hi, this is my first time on a forum, today I received a PCN for a bus lane intervention on globe lane, Chatham, north western arm. I do not live in the area and would never willingly or knowingly go into a bus lane. I did however pay the fine as I figure that you never win!  I am going to drive to the area again tomorrow and see for myself lest I should make the same expensive mistake again. I am all up for motorists being fined for being idiots or unsafe but I am so angry as I am a good, safe and usually vigilant driver. Can I claim my fine back after the event? Has anyone been successful ?apparently my crime was committed on 8th Jan, has the council made any changes to signage at all since these disputes started?

Offline peperami gsxr

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Re: Medway - Chatham bus lane - TPT state "...the contravention did not occur"
« Reply #22 on: 23 January, 2013, 02:13:46 PM »
Welcome Lizzyp.

Can I claim my fine back after the event?



Watch this space is the answer, you wont be able to claim back your money, but the council should offer it to you all being well, we will have to see if they play ball. 

See this link, which in the first post  your find a letter which explains things clearly to the Medway Council sent on the 13th Jan.

http://notomob.co.uk/discussions/index.php/topic,2567.0.html

Sworn to fun, loyalty to none

Offline EDW2000

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Re: Medway - Chatham bus lane - TPT state "...the contravention did not occur"
« Reply #23 on: 23 January, 2013, 09:38:41 PM »
NEW MEAT



BUS LANE PENALTY CHARGE NOTICE XXXXXXXXXX

I refer to your recent appeal regarding the above Bus Lane Penalty Charge Notice.

I would advise that in accordance with the Traffic Management Act 2004 it is the registered keeper of the vehicle who is liable for the penalty charge and not the driver. The onus lies with the owner to pursue the driver for payment.

I can also confirm that the signage in question is fully compliant with the requirements of the road traffic legislation.

I have however noted that you are not from the area and am prepared to allow you a first occasion and am therefore pleased to advise you that the Bus Lane Penalty Charge Notice has been cancelled on this occasion only.

If however you receive a further Penalty Charge Notice for the same contravention then I can advise that this will be upheld.

Yours sincerely,




D Gillan
Medway Council


Di Gillan/Appeals Officer/Parking Services

Annexe B/Civic Centre/Strood/Rochester/Kent/ME2 4AU

Tel: 01634-332266/Fax: 01634-331777

Email: parking@medway.gov.uk

Offline Pat Pending

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Re: Medway - Chatham bus lane - TPT state "...the contravention did not occur"
« Reply #24 on: 23 January, 2013, 11:01:49 PM »
So will they be repaying all previous Penalty's that were contested by people from out of the area?
How far is out of the area?
Is this not discrimination against Local people (who pay their wages)
 :idea:

If I had had my challenge turned down I would now quite rightly be claiming discrimination!
Life should NOT be a journey to the grave with the intention of arriving safely in an attractive and well-preserved body, but rather to skid in sideways - Beer in one hand - chocolate in the other - body thoroughly used up,  totally worn out and screaming "WOO-HOO, what a  ride!!"

Offline The Bald Eagle

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Re: Medway - Chatham bus lane - TPT state "...the contravention did not occur"
« Reply #25 on: 24 January, 2013, 12:46:17 PM »
NEW MEAT



BUS LANE PENALTY CHARGE NOTICE XXXXXXXXXX

I refer to your recent appeal regarding the above Bus Lane Penalty Charge Notice.

I would advise that in accordance with the Traffic Management Act 2004 it is the registered keeper of the vehicle who is liable for the penalty charge and not the driver. The onus lies with the owner to pursue the driver for payment.

I can also confirm that the signage in question is fully compliant with the requirements of the road traffic legislation.

I have however noted that you are not from the area and am prepared to allow you a first occasion and am therefore pleased to advise you that the Bus Lane Penalty Charge Notice has been cancelled on this occasion only.

If however you receive a further Penalty Charge Notice for the same contravention then I can advise that this will be upheld.

Yours sincerely,




D Gillan
Medway Council


Di Gillan/Appeals Officer/Parking Services

Annexe B/Civic Centre/Strood/Rochester/Kent/ME2 4AU

Tel: 01634-332266/Fax: 01634-331777

Email: parking@medway.gov.uk


What date was this EDW?
WE ARE WATCHING YOU

Offline EDW2000

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Re: Medway - Chatham bus lane - TPT state "...the contravention did not occur"
« Reply #26 on: 24 January, 2013, 03:00:30 PM »
I think it was dated about 21 Jan.


Offline The Bald Eagle

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Re: Medway - Chatham bus lane - TPT state "...the contravention did not occur"
« Reply #27 on: 24 January, 2013, 06:18:44 PM »
I think it was dated about 21 Jan.

A definite date would be useful. Are you in touch with the recipient of this letter EDW, and if so would he/she be prepared to contact us?
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Offline EDW2000

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Re: Medway - Chatham bus lane - TPT state "...the contravention did not occur"
« Reply #28 on: 24 January, 2013, 07:39:33 PM »
I will PM him but not know him personally.

http://notomob.co.uk/discussions/index.php?action=forum


I just did his pcn appeal.
« Last Edit: 24 January, 2013, 07:44:03 PM by EDW2000 »

Offline melville-vs-medway

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Re: Medway - Chatham bus lane - TPT state "...the contravention did not occur"
« Reply #29 on: 25 January, 2013, 12:54:49 AM »
Hi

Medway council have recently added a photo of the chatham bus station to their flickr feed...

Shall I add a comment and link to here or to BE's rather excellent letter page...?


Posted to Flickr    January 24, 2013 at 1.51PM GMT
Taken on    October 10, 2011 at 11.11AM GMT


http://www.flickr.com/photos/medwaycouncil/8410365431/##meta/in/photostream


I'm asking as not sure of the web / forum etiquette  <_>


Paul
« Last Edit: 25 January, 2013, 12:58:34 AM by melville-vs-medway »
Check out my signs.. I have made a few copies and they're laminated..

http://paulsweb.hostei.com/notomob/signs/a4-printed-sign.jpg

 


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