Author Topic: F*ck POPLA, we've got bigger fish to fry.  (Read 7413 times)

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Offline Ewan Hoosami

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Re: F*ck POPLA, we've got bigger fish to fry.
« Reply #15 on: 24 October, 2013, 07:47:10 AM »
NEXT!


Appealing to the council is like playing chess with a pigeon. You might be a chess grand master but the pigeon will always knock all the pieces over, shit on the board and then strut around triumphantly.

Offline Pat Pending

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Re: F*ck POPLA, we've got bigger fish to fry.
« Reply #16 on: 24 October, 2013, 10:31:17 PM »
Oh look a so called" Parking Proffesional" or as we call them PARKING WEASELS
Come on Goody2Shoes try and justify this!  :bashy: :bashy: :bashy: :bashy:

or are the notomob Parking Weasels scared of a different viewpoint?  <_>

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-bristol-24653390
« Last Edit: 24 October, 2013, 10:37:05 PM by Pat Pending »
Life should NOT be a journey to the grave with the intention of arriving safely in an attractive and well-preserved body, but rather to skid in sideways - Beer in one hand - chocolate in the other - body thoroughly used up,  totally worn out and screaming "WOO-HOO, what a  ride!!"

Offline Ewan Hoosami

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Re: F*ck POPLA, we've got bigger fish to fry.
« Reply #17 on: 25 October, 2013, 01:21:13 AM »
I expect our weasel friend will be back at half-term, when the schools are shut.

Appealing to the council is like playing chess with a pigeon. You might be a chess grand master but the pigeon will always knock all the pieces over, shit on the board and then strut around triumphantly.

Offline goody2shoes

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Re: F*ck POPLA, we've got bigger fish to fry.
« Reply #18 on: 25 October, 2013, 01:17:55 PM »
No not asleep nor scared off, but hey you know with All Hallows approaching us blood suckers have quite a lot on, not to mention committees and motorists  to educate.  During the lull between Halloween and the Crimbo season (or as I prefer the Bar Humbug free for all) I shall also be off spending my well gotten gains on a warm and balmy holiday so please don’t think I am defeated, shy or snoozing, although sometimes some contributions from the less well educated of your members may be a bit sleep inducing as they can be repetitive.  See even weasels have a sense of humour though it is often lost dealing with lying cheating people who believe the rules don’t apply to them and no I don’t mean the Councillors or other parking colleagues but those who flout the rules and then bitch they’re hard done by.
I won’t defend the indefensible there are times when tickets are issued incorrectly that’s because humans are still ultimately responsible for pressing the keys. However in the case of the Good Samaritan how great the ticket was cancelled on appeal see the system works.  Now I know you will say it shouldn’t have happened and your right and I am sure the DVD evidence will have been rechecked again and if the accident is visible on the screen someone will be up for retraining.  I also know that at times the CCTV does not pick up the whole street scene and the incident may not have been within shot. Much as you hate CCTV have you never considered the benefits of having the correct evidence that clearly shows if a motorist has offended or not? CCTV is a better deterrent to poor parking than a patrolling officer, because motorists become more aware of the cameras over time.   They keep the costs of enforcement down, provide a safer working environment for the officers (as long as no madcap bikers are trying to harass them as they drive along the road, and yes in the early days I have seen video evidence of this recorded by industry colleagues), which is probably why static cameras are a preferred option.
Belplasca yes I agree as would most authorities it would be great to be able to deal with those dangerous driving practices we all see at schools but don’t forget the Councils can only deal with offences that they have the Government given powers to do so.   Personally some of the things I have seen one where the car didn’t slow and didn’t stop before the child was shoved out comes to mind for that one I could cheerfully have crushed the car and the driver never would have held a licence again.  But no doubt some activist would be on a web site saying no harm was done!!
The BBCs programme would not have been good television if it hadn’t had someone saying we had targets, we are threatened with the sack etc.  The Statutory Guidance is clear that Authorities should be able to forecast likely income and expenditure for budgetary reasons.  Many authorities have been operating their parking services for several years and it is the historical data that is used to estimate the likely income from parking charges, the necessary levels of enforcement and associated costs.
Good enforcement managers will know how many tickets are likely to be issued based on that information.  Officers are monitored for performance based on this information and on the performance of other colleagues patrolling the same beats on the same weekdays.  There are many reasons for under performance, some is the beat has become compliant, some is the officer has become lazy or complacent or sometimes afraid of the area, all issues that have to be explored and may need further action be it disciplinary, retraining, welfare support, or changes to the patrol areas and the frequency of visits. 
Sorry if I haven’t responded to all but must now go bats to feed and broomsticks to ready before the big event. 

Offline The Bald Eagle

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Re: F*ck POPLA, we've got bigger fish to fry.
« Reply #19 on: 25 October, 2013, 03:49:49 PM »
No not asleep nor scared off, but hey you know with All Hallows approaching us blood suckers have quite a lot on, not to mention committees and motorists  to educate.  During the lull between Halloween and the Crimbo season (or as I prefer the Bar Humbug free for all) I shall also be off spending my well gotten gains on a warm and balmy holiday so please don’t think I am defeated, shy or snoozing, although sometimes some contributions from the less well educated of your members may be a bit sleep inducing as they can be repetitive.  See even weasels have a sense of humour though it is often lost dealing with lying cheating people who believe the rules don’t apply to them and no I don’t mean the Councillors or other parking colleagues but those who flout the rules and then bitch they’re hard done by.
I won’t defend the indefensible there are times when tickets are issued incorrectly that’s because humans are still ultimately responsible for pressing the keys. However in the case of the Good Samaritan how great the ticket was cancelled on appeal see the system works.  Now I know you will say it shouldn’t have happened and your right and I am sure the DVD evidence will have been rechecked again and if the accident is visible on the screen someone will be up for retraining.  I also know that at times the CCTV does not pick up the whole street scene and the incident may not have been within shot. Much as you hate CCTV have you never considered the benefits of having the correct evidence that clearly shows if a motorist has offended or not? CCTV is a better deterrent to poor parking than a patrolling officer, because motorists become more aware of the cameras over time.   They keep the costs of enforcement down, provide a safer working environment for the officers (as long as no madcap bikers are trying to harass them as they drive along the road, and yes in the early days I have seen video evidence of this recorded by industry colleagues), which is probably why static cameras are a preferred option.
Belplasca yes I agree as would most authorities it would be great to be able to deal with those dangerous driving practices we all see at schools but don’t forget the Councils can only deal with offences that they have the Government given powers to do so.   Personally some of the things I have seen one where the car didn’t slow and didn’t stop before the child was shoved out comes to mind for that one I could cheerfully have crushed the car and the driver never would have held a licence again.  But no doubt some activist would be on a web site saying no harm was done!!
The BBCs programme would not have been good television if it hadn’t had someone saying we had targets, we are threatened with the sack etc.  The Statutory Guidance is clear that Authorities should be able to forecast likely income and expenditure for budgetary reasons.  Many authorities have been operating their parking services for several years and it is the historical data that is used to estimate the likely income from parking charges, the necessary levels of enforcement and associated costs.
Good enforcement managers will know how many tickets are likely to be issued based on that information.  Officers are monitored for performance based on this information and on the performance of other colleagues patrolling the same beats on the same weekdays.  There are many reasons for under performance, some is the beat has become compliant, some is the officer has become lazy or complacent or sometimes afraid of the area, all issues that have to be explored and may need further action be it disciplinary, retraining, welfare support, or changes to the patrol areas and the frequency of visits. 
Sorry if I haven’t responded to all but must now go bats to feed and broomsticks to ready before the big event.

----------------------------------------------

@goody2shoes

These "madcap bikers" that you saw video of allegedly harassing $car operators? Were they members of the No To Mob?
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Offline goody2shoes

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Re: F*ck POPLA, we've got bigger fish to fry.
« Reply #20 on: 25 October, 2013, 04:57:49 PM »
Yes it was but it was when the Mob was very much in it's infancy and hadn't quite perfected the art of following without causing fear.  The drivers of the cctv cars are more used to being followed now as well and know you mean no harm but I am sure you don't/didn't  realise how terrifying if was originally for the vehicle operators to be followed by mask wearing men on bikes that were getting to close.

Offline The Bald Eagle

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Re: F*ck POPLA, we've got bigger fish to fry.
« Reply #21 on: 25 October, 2013, 05:05:28 PM »
@goody2shoes

So it would have been in Westminster then? <_>
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Offline goody2shoes

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Re: F*ck POPLA, we've got bigger fish to fry.
« Reply #22 on: 25 October, 2013, 05:19:31 PM »
Can't think it would do my career much good if I confirm or deny any specific place that I have worked  :-ev-:

Offline The Bald Eagle

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Re: F*ck POPLA, we've got bigger fish to fry.
« Reply #23 on: 25 October, 2013, 05:27:58 PM »
Never mind. It was worth a try. ;)

So anyway, please remind us of exactly how many NTM members were ever arrested or cautioned following the alleged harassment?
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Offline goody2shoes

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Re: F*ck POPLA, we've got bigger fish to fry.
« Reply #24 on: 25 October, 2013, 05:50:45 PM »
I could only speak for the places I have worked and that would give my id away.  I do know in some places the police have been involved but i don't recall any charges.  of course believe it or not no one minds the schunts that's fine so long as you realise that when you wind up the public when you leave the site they remain stirred up and at times get aggressive with the officers that are left on scene.  But as has been said before I may not agree with your point of view but I would defend to the death your right to express it do schunt away after all no one parks illegally and therefore the objective is met, the boroughs wouldn't mind having an officer on every corner telling people not to park, but they are not allowed to fund parking operations from the council tax.

Offline Belplasca

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Re: F*ck POPLA, we've got bigger fish to fry.
« Reply #25 on: 26 October, 2013, 08:08:29 AM »
they are not allowed to fund parking operations from the council tax.

That's interesting.

I thought that the council could fund any of their services from the council tax.

Perhaps you are indicating that parking is no longer seen by councils as a service but rather as a revenue generator?

Whatever. But, perhaps you could back up that statement with the relevant regulations?

(I understood that general council services could not be funded from the "accidental" income (the "surplus") from parking services, which are "ring-fenced" for use on transport expenditure... Have you just got it the wrong way round?)

Bob
« Last Edit: 26 October, 2013, 08:16:23 AM by Belplasca »
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Offline DastardlyDick

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Re: F*ck POPLA, we've got bigger fish to fry.
« Reply #26 on: 26 October, 2013, 11:45:58 AM »
I think what goody2shoes is trying to say is that Parking Operations must be self funding - or at least that's what a Council told me when Enforcement was requested on a road where I used to live.

Offline Belplasca

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Re: F*ck POPLA, we've got bigger fish to fry.
« Reply #27 on: 26 October, 2013, 12:04:03 PM »
I think what goody2shoes is trying to say is that Parking Operations must be self funding - or at least that's what a Council told me when Enforcement was requested on a road where I used to live.

Hopefully, Goody2shoes will be able to back up the claim.

But the provision of parking facilities is just like any other service provided by a council. If the electors are happy for the cost to come out of the council tax, they re-elect the councilors.

And Councils have a duty to provide that service. As far as I know (and I'm happy to be proved wrong!) the council can fund that provision in any way it sees fit. Clearly, it is desirable for the service to be self-funding, But I don't think the law prescribes that.

However, as we all know, Councils are allowed to use any small "surplus" from the charges for parking services ONLY for transport related services.

The simple fact that there is provision for the "surplus" indicated that it is seen as only a possibility and not a certainty, which reinforces my belief that there is no absolute requirement for parking services to be self-funding...

Bob
Blanka (my partner) has signed up on a challenge to help the Marie Curie Hospice in Hampstead.

Help her at http://www.justgivin...lanka-Rathauska

Offline The Bald Eagle

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Re: F*ck POPLA, we've got bigger fish to fry.
« Reply #28 on: 26 October, 2013, 03:55:01 PM »
I do know in some places the police have been involved but i don't recall any charges.


Yes. We have had many a chat with some very nice policemen, all of whom without exception have been satisfied that we were not harassing the $car operators and all of whom without exception were satisfied that we were going about our lawful business.

However, that can't be said of one particular parking manager who lied to the cops in order to try to get us in trouble. (click on link below) and another who threatened a member of the public with physical violence, (click on second link below) and yet others who committed an act of physical violence on three members of the public (click on third link below)


http://notomob.co.uk/discussions/index.php?topic=1770.0

of course believe it or not no one minds the schunts that's fine so long as you realise that when you wind up the public when you leave the site they remain stirred up and at times get aggressive with the officers that are left on scene.


So how is that our fault?

do schunt away after all no one parks illegally and therefore the objective is met,


So why do the vast majority of council contractors (NSL in Waltham Forest have been ordered to remain on street by Karen Naylor and are the only exception I know of) tell their drivers to either try to lose us or return to base?

of course believe it or not no one minds the schunts


Could have fooled me.

http://notomob.co.uk/discussions/index.php/topic,2885.0.html

http://notomob.co.uk/discussions/index.php/topic,2725.0.html





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Offline Kill Switch

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A word to the wise ain't necessary - it's the stupid ones that need the advice


 


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