Author Topic: Proof that ANPR cameras in car parks don't work  (Read 281317 times)

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Offline The Bald Eagle

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Re: Proof that ANPR cameras in car parks don't work
« Reply #210 on: 01 January, 2021, 12:58:14 PM »


The British Parking Association for car park operators told The Sunday Telegraph that ANPR was “99 per cent accurate”.

A spokesman said: “Problems can arise when they drive very close together if there is a queue or the weather is poor. There can be instances where old plates are not read properly.”


See full article below for context

=====================================================


Free car parking loophole is being exploited by classic car owners - Here’s how it works

CLASSIC car owners in Britain are exploiting a parking loophole in Britain which allows them to avoid paying any parking charges.



Classic car owners in the UK are getting free parking due to the exploitation of a loophole. Certain car parks across Britain use high-technology cameras to enforce fines and punishments. Automatic number plate recognition (ANPR) software is used to scan the car registration plate when it enters and exits the car park, noting down the time and details of the plate. Some car parks do not even have barriers in place to prevent drivers from entering and exiting the car park.

Classic car owners are managing to get away without paying these fees due to the usual non-standard number plates allowed on vehicles made before 1975.

Rules introduced in 2015 allows the use of the silver and black number plates on ‘historic vehicles’.

This move has caused some confusion with the technology which is failing to pick up the licence details as it does not follow the standard plate format.

The Federation of British Historic Vehicle Clubs told The Sunday Telegraph that as many as 20 of its members had been exploiting the loophole.


The silver and black number plates aren't being recognised by ANPR cameras (Image: GETTY)

“In the cases of supermarkets you wouldn’t be challenged at all because the system simply wouldn’t recognise you had ever been there,” a spokesman said.

Editor of the Classic Car David Sinister detailed how has been enjoying the free parkignbeneftis of owning a classic car.

The vintage MGB GT driver told The Sunday Telegraph: “The car park I used wasn’t barrier-operated, so when you drove in it had a little LCD matrix screen which will tell you your registration number and how long you were allowed to park there – but it would never recognise it.

“I could park there at 8am, go shopping all day, leave it there for a week and nobody would be any the wiser.

“For me personally, it’s not been a bad thing, but I appreciate it does have more serious implications.”

Despite the National Police Chief Council (NPCC) admitted that the plate could be misread, they are really involved in any criminality as they are often very easily identifiable.

The British Parking Association for car park operators told The Sunday Telegraph that ANPR was “99 per cent accurate”.

A spokesman said: “Problems can arise when they drive very close together if there is a queue or the weather is poor. There can be instances where old plates are not read properly.”


https://www.express.co.uk/life-style/cars/1110267/Classic-car-parking-loophole-UK-free-ANPR-cameras
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Offline Web Admin

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Re: Proof that ANPR cameras in car parks don't work
« Reply #211 on: 27 January, 2021, 12:46:27 PM »
#178

War veteran wins battle to get 'monstrous' £100 parking ticket cancelled
Car park owners Falmouth Harbour Commissioners cancelled the fine issued by Civil Enforcement Ltd in their car park after Cornwall Live contacted them

13:24, 20 JAN 2021UPDATED13:47, 20 JAN 2021


94-year-old Henry Philp, with his wife outside his car in Helston

A Cornish Second World War veteran who received a £100 parking charge after incorrectly entering a small part of his number plate at a car park has had the fine cancelled after Cornwall Live intervened in his case.

Henry Philp, 94, who served with the Royal Artillery in the Second World War was given the “monstrous” fine after he mis-input two letters of his registration plate when visiting Custom House Quay car park in Falmouth in November. After receiving a number of fine letters branded from the private company, Civil Enforcement Ltd, which enforces parking at the car park owned by Falmouth Harbour Commissioners, his daughter contacted Cornwall Live.

Falmouth Harbour Commissioners cancelled the parking fine after contact was made by the family with the guidance of one of our reporters, leaving Mr Philp “delighted” by the result.

He said: “I feel excellent, absolutely delighted to hear that the fine was cancelled. I felt it all left a bit of a bad taste and I learned that I am far from the only one to have received one. It feels like motorists are a threatened species.

"I’m so pleased Cornwall Live did what they set out to do after my daughter got in touch and brought a bit of sanity to it all. I was incensed and so was my daughter and that’s why she contacted you.

“I’m so pleased it’s something less to worry about. As you get older when this sort of thing happens it can get to you as things worry you more.”

Mr Philp also felt that the system involving registration plates unfairly punished older motorists. “When you get older, things get a bit harder to do than for younger people, such as those who probably designed this system don’t realise," he said. "They were small, silver buttons placed low and it’s harder to see if you’re my age, so it’s much easier to make a mistake.

“I think it’s bad how you can be punished for a slight error without any consideration given into the fact that you tried to act honestly, and could prove that. Most people go to the machine, pay their dues and pay for their space and don’t think anything else of it.”


The parking fine letter, with "Civil Enforcement" branding that Mr Philp received.

While he felt that Falmouth Harbour Commissioners were “extremely helpful” in how they dealt with the complaint once brought to their attention, Mr Philp described the actions of Creative Parking Ltd, also known as Civil Enforcement, as “like that of a money-making racket”. He said: “The Civil Enforcement were disgraceful. They thought they were being magnanimous in offering a small discount to the fine after the circumstances were explained but frankly it wasn’t good enough because they were still aiming to get their money.

"I think something needs to be done about issues like mine where I’ve paid their dues and just made a mistake, although I’m pleased the commissioners did the right thing I suspect there’s many that don’t get the same luck. It feels wrong to me.”

Mr Philp added as words of caution to others: “Always make sure you keep your tickets. I’m glad I did. I did reflect on that afterwards, that sometimes people get rid of their tickets because they thought, 'Parking paid, been and gone, it’s all done' and if I’d done that I would have no way of proving I paid for my ticket. Keeping the car tidy could have cost me £100."

https://www.cornwalllive.com/news/cornwall-news/war-veteran-gets-monstrous-100-4894481

Offline Overlord

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Re: Proof that ANPR cameras in car parks don't work
« Reply #212 on: 28 January, 2021, 07:38:55 PM »
Many years ago when I was in business, I employed a couple people and one of them always had trouble with numbers. He always managed to transpose figures in the part numbers. This is quite a common problem and can easily happen when inputting registration numbers in ticket machines.  These machines and their ANPR equivalents should be taken out of service. They're no fit for purpose.

Offline 2b1ask1

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Re: Proof that ANPR cameras in car parks don't work
« Reply #213 on: 01 February, 2021, 10:11:41 AM »
I one four could not agree more!
Willing to do my bit...

Offline The Bald Eagle

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Re: Proof that ANPR cameras in car parks don't work
« Reply #214 on: 02 February, 2021, 02:19:38 PM »
#179

A photo taken when entering and exiting a car park IS NOT PROOF OF PARKING

===============================================================


23rd January 2021

Driver’s warning after £100 fine from north Carlisle car park he couldn't park in



No spaces: Heads Lane car park, Carlisle. There was no spaces available at the time

A MOTORIST is warning others after he received a parking fine for entering a city carpark to look for a space, leaving minutes later because it was full.

Hilton Sanderson entered the Heads Lane car park, at West Walls, Carlisle in December, he drove around the car park for five minutes before leaving because there were no spaces available.

Much to Mr Sanderson’s shock a letter arrived in the post only days later informing him that he had been charged for his five minute stay in the car park, despite him not parking, leaving his vehicle or anyone entering his vehicle.

He explained: “I was on West Walls and when I went into the car park to park and there were no spaces so I came back out again and a week later I got a ticket. So I wrote to them telling them I hadn’t parked, I’d just gone into park and there were no signs telling the car park was full.

“I didn’t get out the car and no one got in the car and I didn’t park. I just went in turned, waited until another car went passed me and then came out again.”

After Mr Sanderson wrote to the Carparkingpartnership (CPP) they turned down his appeal. Now, Mr Sanderson has written to the company parking on private land appeals (POPLA) and is waiting for a form to a appeal the decision.

He has been charged £100 for the charge and doesn’t intent to pay this. Mr Sanderson is wanting to warn others that they could fall victim to the same thing.

When he first received the letter in the post this was quite a shock to him, especially because he didn’t park and doesn’t believe he has committed a crime.

‘It was a real shock because I didn’t do anything wrong,” said Mr Sanderson.

“If I’d been parking when I should have been or there was some parking offence I would have just paid up and admitted to it. You can see I entered at 12.30pm and left at 12.35pm. I’m not disputing the fact I was there, just the fact I didn’t park.”

Mr Sanderson’s hope was that when he wrote to CPP and explained what had happened they would quash the parking charge and he would be able to move on.

In the letter he wrote to them he said: “On the date and time stated on your parking charge notice I did enter the car park but was unable to find a vacant parking space.

“I waited until I was able to turn and leave the car park. As your cameras will show I did not get out of the car and no one got in. This was reflected in the short time I was there, five minutes. I consider this parking demand a complete waste of time and have no intention of paying such a ridiculous amount for something that was beyond my control. Also, there was no indication that the car park was full.”

Mr Sanderson then received a letter back which read: “I advise you that your recent bill has been unsuccessful.”

A Parkingeye spokesman said: “The motorist on this occasion chose to appeal via POPLA, an independent body which reviews all parking disputes. It ruled against the motorist and upheld the PCN.”

https://www.newsandstar.co.uk/news/19028372.motorists-warning-100-unfair-charge-carlisle-car-park/
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Offline Web Admin

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Re: Proof that ANPR cameras in car parks don't work
« Reply #215 on: 22 February, 2021, 11:06:22 AM »
#180

Hemel man warns others after receiving 'ridiculous' parking fine at Tesco
Horizon have now cancelled the parking charge notice

By Holly Patel
Tuesday, 2nd February 2021, 12:09 pm


A man from Hemel Hempstead is warning others after receiving a 'ridiculous' parking fine for exceeding the maximum stay period at Tesco.

Tony received the parking fine notice from Horizon Parking Ltd on Friday, January 22, after visiting the supermarket at Jarman Park.

The letter says he stayed from 2pm on Friday, January 8, through to 1pm the next day (January 9).




He said: "I had gone to Tesco on the way home from work on the Friday lunchtime and forgot a couple of things so had to do a repeat trip the next day.

"From my address, which they obviously had since they sent me a letter, it would have been pretty clear that I would not have left a car at Jarman Park, made my way several miles home (with or without shopping) and returned the next day.

"It's a ridiculous fine, perhaps it's not their fault, just faulty software – but they are happy to send out a quite threatening letter demanding £70, reduced to £30 'if paid within 14 days of the days of the date of this letter'.

"I want to share my experience and raise awareness so if anyone else has to go through this, it might save them a bit of time.

"I filled out an online form to contest the charge, but would have to wait up to 45 days for an answer. I tried phoning the store and it's an automated phone system which pretty much said 'not our problem, contact the parking firm'.

"I then went to the store and the manager told me it was not their problem, but eventually they took my letter and said they would contact the company.

"No apology though, and no acknowledgement that if Tesco have subcontracted parking checks they might actually retain some responsibility for their customer experience.

"I want to make people aware of this issue so they don't have to experience this very frustrating situation.

"From my experience contacting Tesco by phone was pointless, but going to the store, the staff were helpful in the end, and it may have influenced Horizon to back off, or they might have cancelled it without Tesco helping."

Tony was contacted by Horizon this week, informing him that the Parking Charge Notice had now been cancelled and no further action would be taken.

He said: "I received an email from Horizon saying that after investigating they have cancelled the fine.

"It said there was an error with the technology, which resulted in the fine, they did also say that they are constantly trying to improve the system.

"I understand these things happen but I just want to save someone else the time if this happens to them."

Tesco say there have not been any other reports of parking charges issued incorrectly at the store

A Tesco spokesperson said: “In car parks where there is a high demand for spaces we place a time limit on parking so that we can make sure our customers are able to find a space.

"In this case, a parking charge notice was issued in error and we are sorry that this happened.”

The Hemel Gazette has contacted Horizon Parking for a comment on this story but is yet to receive a response.

The Gazette called Horizon Parking and was directed to the websiteas the customer service helpline was currently unavailable due to the coronavirus pandemic.

https://www.hemeltoday.co.uk/news/people/hemel-man-warns-others-after-receiving-ridiculous-parking-fine-tesco-3121028

Offline The Bald Eagle

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Re: Proof that ANPR cameras in car parks don't work
« Reply #216 on: 03 March, 2021, 08:33:50 AM »
#181

It has to be wrong when the law has been twisted to the extent that a private parking company can force you to prove your innocence in a court, when everyone else has the presumption of innocence until proven guilty

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Woman charged £160 after stay at NCP multi-storey car park in Portsmouth city centre vows to take her fight to court

A WOMAN who claims she was unfairly ticketed in a Portsmouth car park says she will take her fight to court – and she is calling on others affected to form an action group.

Monday, 22nd February 2021, 9:47 pm


Joanne Etherington, of Hayling Island, received a parking charge from car park operator NCP after she parked in its multi-storey car park in Crasswell Street on August 16.

The 52-year-old carer had stayed for just under two hours, however when she went to pay, she said the machine would not accept her card.

She said: ‘I went to go and pay but the machine would not take my £2 coin as it was not accepting change due to Covid.



‘I went to put my card in instead and it just wouldn’t work.

‘Originally it would not accept it, and when I tried a second time, the transaction seemed to go through but two weeks later I received a charge notice saying I owed £160.

‘I have appealed but they say as several other payments had been made by other people on the same day then my appeal was not successful.


NCP car park in Crasswell Street, Portsmouth.

‘Now they are threatening to take me to court. I am more than happy to go in front of a district judge and say my case.

‘There is obviously a problem with the machine. I would like to get a group together to show that it’s not just me, that there are many more people having this problem.’

Joanne, a mum of three, got in touch with The News after reading about a similar case, where Allan and Sheila Birt, from Southsea, experienced problems paying by card in December, so left the car park after 11 minutes and still received a charge.

They said the machine was faulty, and that others had also been experiencing problems, however parking firm NCP said this was not the case. They have now settled their case after NCP agreed to drop the charge to £20.



Joanne said this was just one of many other cases that she has heard about.

She said: ‘It is just an easy way for them to make money, especially when fewer people are using their car parks due to the pandemic.

‘My case happened in August, Mr and Mrs Birt’s happened in December, so it just shows that NCP was aware there was a problem but that it has not been fixed.

‘How much money have they made in that time? It is a lot of hassle to appeal and the letters can come across as very threatening and official so other people may pay up.

‘I hope I can help others.’

https://www.portsmouth.co.uk/business/consumer/woman-charged-ps160-after-stay-at-ncp-multi-storey-car-park-in-portsmouth-city-centre-vows-to-take-her-fight-to-court-3143177
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Offline The Bald Eagle

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Re: Proof that ANPR cameras in car parks don't work
« Reply #217 on: 28 March, 2021, 06:09:41 PM »
#182  Courtesy of Mr Mustard

====================================


22 March 2021
Barnet Hospital - ANPR - designed to cheat?

Mr Mustard doesn't get heavily involved in private parking charges as they can end up in the county court and he has no desire to spend half a day sitting around and he doesn't have audience rights without requesting them.

Sometimes though a friend wanders along with a demand which is so patently wrong and unreasonable that he has to put fingers, both of them, to keyboard.

Here are the images which were on the demand for £100



Let us call Mr Mustard's friend, Miss V. She was dropping her friend at the fracture clinic and then going back later to collect her, hospitals not liking extra people who aren't strictly necessary for medical or safety reasons, with the patient. Accordingly there were two or more other unseen photos both at around the same time as the two which were selected, which didn't prove that anyone was in any car park, staff or otherwise, for 1 hour and 52 minutes, Miss V (and her car) being safely at home enjoying a cup of tea and a read of the newspaper whilst she waited for a phone call.
Mr Mustard posted this letter off in the name of Miss V on 16 March.



Fast forward two days and Parking Eye have slammed the ANPR into reverse.



Their willingness to immediately cancel points to the veracity of the facts, there being two visits, not one and thus the alleged breach of contract did not take place and no parking charge was due.
If the same has happened to you, follow Mr Mustard's lead and demand all of your data. The interest of Parking Eye in your wallet or purse may rapidly wane.

ANPR is only as good as the way in which the data has been manipulated, clearly disgracefully in this instance in a one sided manner to suit their purpose of revenue raising.

https://lbbspending.blogspot.com/2021/03/barnet-hospital-anpr-designed-to-cheat.html
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Offline The Bald Eagle

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Re: Proof that ANPR cameras in car parks don't work
« Reply #218 on: 31 March, 2021, 06:34:10 AM »
#183

“We suspect that human error may be the cause of the problem.”

No mate. It's the cameras that are the problem. If a human being was seen slapping tickets on legally parked vehicles this scam would have been nipped in the bud.

And the worst thing about this is that the new legislation (Parking (Code of Practice) Act 2019), won't stop this kind of abuse.


=================================================================

£100 fine for parking to get Covid jab in Telford
By Deborah HardimanWellingtonCoronavirusPublished: Mar 20, 2021

Motorists parking near a coronavirus vaccine centre have been inadvertently issued with penalty tickets.



Terry Rickard, 62, was stunned to get a £100 parking ticket after visiting the coronavirus vaccination centre at AFC Telford

People travelling to AFC Telford, which is being used as a jab hub, are allowed to use a nearby car park with the vehicle registration details collected by centre staff and volunteers on arrival.

However, vaccine centre operators Wellington Pharmacy said they were mystified by complaints that £100 fixed penalty notices were being issued and added that human error may be to blame for the mix-up.

Terry Rickard, 62, of Church Street, Hadley, and his wife Christine, 61, received a notice after leaving their car near the Whitehouse Hotel on March 3.

“We drove there and followed the yellow signs for the vaccine centre. When we pulled in a young lady wrote down our registration number in a big book.

“We assumed we were doing everything right. We were there for less than 30 minutes.

"We were very surprised to get a fixed penalty ticket. We were now wondering if other people have received them.

“We’re concerned that some older people will feel a bit worried if they get one and might pay it without querying it,” Mr Rickard said.

Vaccine site manager Kishan Mehta said: “We are a little mystified about why people are getting parking tickets.

"The car park is managed by ES Parking and we have a device to log the registration numbers of the vehicles belonging to patients coming for their vaccines so there shouldn’t be any issues.

“We suspect that human error may be the cause of the problem.”

https://www.shropshirestar.com/news/health/coronavirus-covid19/2021/03/20/telford-vaccine-centre-visitors-in-100-parking-penalty-mix-up/
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Offline Overlord

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Re: Proof that ANPR cameras in car parks don't work
« Reply #219 on: 31 March, 2021, 11:55:45 PM »
Human error my arse. Looks more like a phishing scam to me in the hope of conning money out of vulnerable people who are too scared to contest it!! SCUM!!! :-ev-:

Offline Web Admin

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Re: Proof that ANPR cameras in car parks don't work
« Reply #220 on: 20 April, 2021, 06:12:48 PM »
Holbeach area couple have fought parking fine at Boston hospital

By Victoria Fear - victoria.fear@iliffepublishing.co.uk
 Published: 16:00, 03 April 2021


The husband of a terminally ill woman has successfully fought a hospital parking fine.

Malcolm Munson (69) had tried to pay the £1 parking charge at Boston’s Pilgrim Hospital during a half-hour visit on February 26.

The machine had returned his coin, stating that he had 30 minutes free parking - but he later received a letter demanding that he pay £42.



After calls from the Guardian, United Lincolnshire Hospitals Trust waived the fee and confirmed 30 minutes’ free parking is still offered at the hospital.

Mr Munson, who is also a Blue Badge holder, had been to hospital for a regular appointment with wife Sandra (69), who was diagnosed with a rare form of lung cancer and has defied doctors’ expectations.

Before the fine was rescinded, Mr Munson, of Gedney, said: “We were having such a good day as Sandra had her CT scan and we were in and out within 30 minutes.

“But we have been having a poor time ever since trying to sort it out.

“I went back to make sure that I was right, otherwise I would have paid it but I am right so I’m not paying it.”

The couple had arrived at 2.41pm on February 26 and were due to leave at 3.11pm.

Mr Munson said that he had been struggling with the parking machine and had approached the parking attendant to help.

He said: “The machine chucked out the £1, saying that we had 30 minutes free parking.

“Now they are threatening me with parking charges. If I pay within 28 days it is £42... but that goes up to £70.”

Mr and Mrs Munson have been married for 10 years after meeting five years before via the lonely hearts column in the Lincolnshire Free Press and Spalding Guardian.

She was diagnosed with a rare form of lung cancer six years ago.

Mr Munson said: “They gave her eight months and she is still here.”

Hospital chief executive Andrew Morgan said: “Parking for Blue Badge holders at our hospitals is free, once the vehicle has been pre-registered at main reception with the Blue Badge displayed in the windscreen.

“On this occasion we will contact Parking Eye to waive the Parking Charge Notice as a gesture of goodwill.”

https://www.spaldingtoday.co.uk/news/just-the-ticket-9193654/

Offline The Bald Eagle

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Re: Proof that ANPR cameras in car parks don't work
« Reply #221 on: 20 April, 2021, 06:37:54 PM »
#185

There is so much wrong with this it's difficult to know where to start.

==========================================================

Swanley residents outraged after receiving town centre 'parking charges' for driving down Nightingale Way to access Aldi supermarket

By Sean Delaney
sdelaney@thekmgroup.co.uk
13:45, 23 March 2021 | Updated: 09:43, 25 March 2021


Residents are outraged after claiming to have received numerous "parking fines" for driving along a back road to reach shops and doctor appointments.

Motorists are refusing to pay a £100 charge for using Nightingale Way to access services in Swanley town centre.


Swanley Town centre's Nightingale Way car park.

Over the last few weeks shoppers attempting to access the Aldi supermarket - which has a free car park for customers - are said to have been stung by the fee at the adjacent Nightingale Way car park.

The parking facility is run by County Car Parks Ltd (CCP Ltd) which has numerous cameras operating on site and face the supermarket.

But various residents claim they have been snapped simply travelling through an access road, Nightingale Way, without stopping.

Diane Weekes lives locally and regularly shops at Aldi in the town centre.

The 63-year-old care worker was shocked to find a parking charge notice put through her letter box on Saturday.


Diane Weekes, 63, was fined for driving down Nightingale Way to get to Aldi

"I normally go via St Mary's Road but that day I went round the back way.

"I only went to Aldi. I went round and you can see the cameras are facing their car park."

According to the parking charge notice, Diane's vehicle was recorded parking for more than 30 minutes in the town centre car park but she says the photos only show her entering and exiting Nightingale Way to access Aldi.

She added: "There must be hundreds of people and the thing is at this time people have not got that sort of money spare.

"Money is tight as it is without that sort of thing weighing down on you."

Julia Ovenell works in Swanley and regularly uses the side road to reach the supermarket.


Swanley residents claim they have been hit with parking fines for 'driving through' a road to access other services.

She said: "I got a parking fine at the weekend stating that I have 'parked’ down this road on March 10, which is false. I drove to get to Aldi and parked in the Aldi car park.

"I have been down this road another three times, so am I going to get issued another three fines to come through the post?

"I'm so angry about it. All I have done is drive down Nightingale Way to get to Aldi's car park, I’ve done my shopping and exited."

The office worker says she will now avoid the area for fear of future fines.

She added: "I certainly won’t be using the shops there again. Nobody needs this stress and worry at the moment with people losing their jobs and being furloughed and it will be the shops who lose out as they will lose trade."

Others shoppers and road users took to social media to vent their frustration after being snapped while dropping relatives off for doctors appointments.


Nightingale Way in Swanley which leads to the Aldi car park

Several residents have contacted Sevenoaks MP Laura Trott expressing their concerns.

A petition has also been set up calling for fines to be cancelled and has amassed more than 750 signatures in under 24-hours.

Blue badge holder Bob Wiltshere has lived in Swanley all his life but says he now avoids parking in the town centre for fear of such charges.

The 75-year-old former bus driver said: "There is going to be a lot of people not shopping there.

"There is no notice, it is a service road. Motorists are easy prey to anybody."

Swanley Town Council said it understood the "frustration and distress" and had been in "lengthy discussions" with both the car park management firm and the new town centre owners.


Swanley Town centre.Nightingale Way/Aldi car parking

Chief executive Ryan Hayman said they were "lobbying for changes to be made to the system, and for all fines issued to date to be cancelled".

In a further statement the authority said: "The parking firm have repeatedly made it clear to us that they do not believe any fines have been issued incorrectly and refuse to give a blanket cancellation of all fines to date as we requested.

"They state as the road is part of the private land, the cameras have been positioned deliberately to capture images correctly on entry and exit of the site.

However, it added "driving along the road is still free without stopping".

Property and investment company London Cambridge Properties (LCP), which manages Swanley Square on behalf of the landlord Evolve Estates Ltd, said the automatic number plate recognition (ANPR) system was installed in January prior to its acquisition of the estate, and it went live earlier this month.

New signage was also erected across the site in January to update users regarding the new ANPR system.

LCP says users can now pay for parking via the machine with cash or card or they can download an app to their mobile devices to pay.

A spokesman for the company said: “As manager for Swanley Square, we place great emphasis on the safety and security of our visitors.

"We have met with CCP Parking, which manages the parking at Swanley Square on LCP’s behalf, and have been assured that after reviewing each incident, where a fine has been issued, it confirmed that a breach has occurred.”

Last year, the owners of Nightingale Way had the road marked with double red lines at the request of Swanley Town Council, which had noted drivers ignoring the yellow lines and continuing to park along the road and kerbsides.

The town council says if anyone believes their fine has been issued unfairly then they can appeal here.

Those dissatisfied with the outcome of the appeal can have this reviewed by POPLA, an independent body.

Car park management firm CCP Ltd have been contacted for comment.

https://www.kentonline.co.uk/dartford/news/im-so-angry-all-i-have-done-is-drive-down-to-aldi-244368/
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Offline The Bald Eagle

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Re: Proof that ANPR cameras in car parks don't work
« Reply #222 on: 30 April, 2021, 02:45:45 PM »
Have just noticed that this thread has passed the 200,000 views mark
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Offline The Bald Eagle

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Re: Proof that ANPR cameras in car parks don't work
« Reply #223 on: 05 May, 2021, 09:55:46 AM »
#186

"If the customer had communicated with us, appealed and shown us the bank statement after the initial notice was issued, then we would have been able to understand why there was no payment recorded against their parked vehicle and could have cancelled this PCN a couple of years ago."

Yes, but if the anpr system didn't allow motorists to enter details for a vehicle that has never entered the car park, the ticket would not have been issued in the first place.  <bashy2> :bashy: <bashy2> :bashy: <bashy2> :bashy:

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Two-year battle over £2.50 NCP parking ticket mistake

Baljit Samra refused to back down, insisting the ticket had been paid

ByMatthew LodgeTrainee Reporter
05:15, 4 APR 2021UPDATED11:08, 5 APR 2021



Baljit Samra says he paid to park in Derby city centre but was still given a penalty ticket

A Derby man was threatened with court action after a simple mistake triggered a huge fine.

Baljit Samra says he was issued with the fine by National Car Parks (NCP) after his car was parked in the company's Siddals Road car park in Derby city centre on December 24, 2018.

He says since then he has been receiving letters demanding he pays a £268 fine, more than 100 times the £2.50 actually spent on the parking ticket.

The 52-year-old said the company had threatened to take him to court despite the fact he has a bank statement proving the ticket was paid for and money was deposited into the company's coffers on the day of the alleged violation.

NCP says that if Mr Samra had communicated with them earlier then the initial mistake could have been rectified. Instead the situation escalated until Mr Samra was facing court action.

Mr Samra, from Littleover, says when he and his wife initially began to receive letters a month after parking at the car park, they thought it was a scam.

"My wife was in the car, she went to town on December 24, 2018, parked opposite Intu Derby in the NCP car park," he said.

"She paid by contactless and she wasn't given a ticket, but it was on her bank statement as being paid.

"A couple of months later we got a message saying we hadn't paid, but we had.

"We thought it might be a scam so we ignored it, but then we started getting other letters from a company called BW Legal saying it we do not pay they were going to take us to court.

"I phoned them up to find out what was going on. I said we've paid it, look on our bank statement.

"We sent them the details, they came back saying there was no record of us paying."

The father-of-two says there was no way he was going to back down when he knows they had done nothing wrong.

"I got in contact with BW Legal again, I said I'm going to dispute this all the way, as our statement says we've paid," he said.

"The last letter I received from them they said the car wasn't registered and they couldn't find it and that we might have put the wrong registration in.

"I think the next step is court. They're threatening a county court judgement and I don't want that on my record."

A spokesperson for NCP told Derbyshire Live the parking charge notice had originally been issued in January 2019.

"We had no contact from the customer until February 2021, by this point the PCN had escalated through our debt recovery process back in 2019," she said.


Mr Samra's car was parked in Siddals Road car park

"We have looked back through the logs for 2018 when the customer parked, since the customer has now sent us his bank statement and can see that the customer put in an incorrect registration plate into the machine when making payment and therefore no payment was recorded against his vehicle in the car park.

"So the PCN was correctly issued.

"When this happens we ask our customers to let us know if they feel the notice is incorrectly issued, we can then look into the case to understand why there is no payment registered.

"Despite the issuing of the PCN and all the information regarding how to appeal, we had no contact from this customer to any of our letters until 2021."

"We have now withdrawn this notice and recorded it as a customer error on inputting the registration plate," she said.

"If the customer had communicated with us, appealed and shown us the bank statement after the initial notice was issued, then we would have been able to understand why there was no payment recorded against their parked vehicle and could have cancelled this PCN a couple of years ago."

https://www.derbytelegraph.co.uk/news/derby-news/two-year-battle-over-250-5260774
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Re: Proof that ANPR cameras in car parks don't work
« Reply #224 on: 18 May, 2021, 11:05:15 AM »
#187 to 190

The £100 fines at Llangrannog car park which are 'putting people off' from visiting

Llangrannog should be able to attract people from all over Wales and the rest of the UK, but there are fears that people are staying away because of the 'unacceptable' running of a car park

ByRobert Harries Senior Reporter
04:00, 8 MAY 2021 UPDATED 09:05, 8 MAY 2021



Welcome to Llangrannog - just be careful where you park

An infamous car park is still fining people £100 and “putting people off” visiting a Welsh tourist destination.

On a recent trip to Llangrannog in Ceredigion to discuss the impact of coronavirus and how the seaside village hopes to overcome the effects of a global pandemic, there was one thing that everyone wanted to talk about - and it wasn’t Covid-19.

“Are you here to talk about the car park?” one local woman asked, while one visitor said they couldn't stay long, leading to a business owner replying, without a second’s hesitation, “because of the car park?”

The privately owned car park sits right in the middle of the village, surrounded by shops, cafes, two pubs and a beach. Complaints have long flooded in about the car park, which is run and managed by One Parking Solution Ltd, a company based in west Sussex. They have installed a camera as you arrive, which clocks every car coming in and out, noting the exact time of their arrival and their exit.

#187 Back in 2019, the issue with the car park was a fairly simple one, or so it seemed.

The pay and display machine was regularly out of order, meaning that you could not pay with cash. There was no facility to pay by card either, so users would have two choices: phone a number to arrange payment or download and use an app on their phone to register payment.



Signage at the car park, which warns people that they could face fines of £100

However, if there is one thing more infamous in Llangrannog than its controversial car park it’s the less than robust internet connection.

This, coupled with the fact that people could not get through to the number displayed on the machine, meant that visitors were stuck. They had already entered the car park and parked, all the while the camera attached to the side of the Ship Inn (the proprietors of which have nothing to do with the running of the car park) was recording their feeble attempts to pay.

“This system relies on a machine that works all the time and a reliable internet connection. That’s not possible here,” said one local.


As a result, people were fined £100, some even more than that. The issue was so febrile that Ceredigion MP Ben Lake became involved, while one tourist who visited the lovely west Wales village even wrote to the local welfare committee and said they would not be returning again, declaring Llangrannog a “no go zone”.

In December 2019, a thawing of the ice occurred, with the owners of the car park offering free parking over the winter months as a “goodwill gesture” to the people of Llangrannog. Furthermore, a card payment facility was then installed at the car park, something that is now in place and functioning. But issues clearly remain.

#188 One woman who drove to Llangrannog in recent weeks said she believes she paid enough to cover the duration of her stay. Getting the ticket at 1.36pm, she thought she would have been free to park at the site until 3.36pm. However, despite leaving the car park at 3.15pm, she later received a notice in the post demanding she paid a fine of £100.

“I went down to Llangrannog over the Easter holidays,” explained Sara Powell, a barrister with links to Ceredigion and who lives in Cowbridge.

“Then a couple of weeks later I got this letter in the post - it was a fine for £100. So I put a post up on Facebook to see if anyone else had had any similar issues and I couldn’t believe the amount of people that replied - there were so many people saying the same.

“My friend got fined wrongly before and challenged it - they got back to her and said they would let her off, but it was their mistake. There was no apology at all. Then I know someone else who was fined but didn’t receive a letter. The first she heard about it was when she received a chasing letter saying that the amount owed was now up to £180.

“It’s a huge problem because I’ve had people contact me to say they have ignored fines and they now have CCJs (County Court Judgements) to deal with. Others then are intimidated by these awful letters they send out demanding payment.”



Not a pretty sight: the entrance to the car park when the issue first raised its head in 2019

The issue for visitors is the potential of receiving a large fine in the post, but the wider issue for the people who live in and around Llangrannog and rely on its ability to draw people in is the idea that the car park can dissuade others from wanting a day at the beach, and therefore a day in the cafes, the shops and the pubs.

“I have three friends who all live in the local area, with young children, and they went to Llangrannog a couple of years ago,” said Sara.

“Two of them got fines in the post, so they haven’t been back since. One of them even admitted that she went over the time, so she went back to Llangrannog to get another ticket to cover what she went over, before sending it to the company to ask if they could, if you like, call it quits. They obviously said no and fined her £180 and ended up bringing court action against her.

“It’s putting people off going to Llangrannog. If you have mobility issues or small children you can’t really park anywhere else because the other car park is a bit of a walk from the beach and the village itself.

“I’m quite used to having parking fines over the years but this is definitely the highest I’ve ever experienced. £100 is huge. It seems like such an injustice; people can ill afford to pay these fines. How much money is the company behind it making? We’re talking potentially thousands of pounds.”


Signs previously placed at the car park advising people to turn around and park elsewhere

Sara is not alone in her dismay at the parking situation in Llangrannog.

#189 Edward Rees, from the Carmarthen area, drove to Llangrannog recently with his family for a day out. When they arrived, they couldn’t find a parking spot immediately so they waited in the car until one became available and then made their way over to the ticket machine to pay for parking. Simple enough, or so one would think.

“We got this letter in the post saying that we hadn’t paid for parking and that we owed the company £100,” Mr Rees said.

“I spoke to my wife because I was certain that we had indeed paid for parking - and she confirmed that and was able to find the ticket in the car. It turns out that when entering the full registration number we had input one of the digits incorrectly by mistake.

“I obviously queried that because it was an honest error, but we had still paid for parking. They then said that, despite acknowledging that we had paid, we had gone over their ‘grace period’ of ten minutes before paying. That’s because we were waiting for a space, with our children in the back of the car. Now we have to pay £100.”

Mr Rees has already lodged an appeal but has been told in no uncertain terms that it has been unsuccessful. One Parking Solution Ltd is demanding a payment of £100 by May 27, or a reduced rate of £60 if Mr Rees pays by May 13. Explaining their decision, the company said: “We find this parking charge to be issued correctly and we are therefore unable to cancel the Parking Charge Notice. We must advise you that once the discounted settlement rate (if applicable) passes it will not be offered again. You have now reached the end of our internal appeals procedure.”



The car park sits in the heart of the village of Llangrannog

A quick look at the TripAdvisor page for Llangrannog (the village as a whole) is inundated with complaints about the car park. One visitor called it “pathetic”, while another called it “stupid” and implored people not to use the facility at all.

#190 Another said they, similarly to Mr Rees, received a £100 fine despite paying for parking because they had taken too long to enter their details. They said: “There were at least six other people having difficulties with the meter when I was there and one elderly lady had to ask the staff at the ice cream parlour to help her.

"My visit was marred by the parking fiasco and all I could think of was to ensure that I left the car park on time. I cannot believe that the local authority are allowing this situation to continue as Llangrannog is going to be penalised when holidaymakers go elsewhere.”

Llangrannog Welfare Committee has even set up a dedicated page to help people who have received “unfair fines from One Parking Solution”. The committee goes on to warn people that: “If you cannot pay within 10 minutes of entering the car park, you should leave and not park there, or you will be fined. They do not listen to reasonable excuses. If the machine is broken, they still expect you to pay.”


The page also states that the committee and locals have “tried very hard to get rid of” One Parking Solution Ltd, but said those efforts have proved unsuccessful.

Concerns raised about the car park and its management have been put to One Parking Solution Ltd, which has not responded to requests for a comment. Efforts have also been made to contact the owner of the land, who employs One Parking Solution Ltd to manage the car park and administer fines. The owner has thus far not responded to attempts to clarify the ongoing issues at the car park.

Anthony Ramsey-Williams, a trustee of the trust which owns the car park, did speak in 2019 when he said a meeting took place with the local welfare committee to “review the car parking arrangements with them” - something that led to the introduction of a one-hour tariff (rather than a two-hour minimum).

Ceredigion Council was also asked to comment on the situation, although it should be noted that as the car park is owned privately it is not the authority’s responsibility to manage it or dictate how much is charged for parking or how much is in turn charged as a fine. The council did advise people who believe they have been wrongly issued with a parking notice to contact the Citizens Advice consumer helpline on 03454 040506.

The council added that, while its trading standards team has "some powers available to them to investigate offences committed within the county", as the car park's operator is based outside the county, it "may be more appropriate that the home authority of the car park operator looks into the matter further".

One person who has already been contacted by numerous people left out of pocket after a trip to Llangrannog is Ceredigion MP Ben Lake. He has previously raised the issue with the British Parking Association and has called the issuing of some fines “unacceptable”.

“It has been two years since I first met with the local community to discuss their concerns about the parking system in Llangrannog,” said Mr Lake.

“I conveyed these concerns to the British Parking Association, who subsequently investigated and reported on the situation. It is therefore extremely disappointing that this private company continues to operate in such a way.

“There have been long standing concerns about the payment machines and lack of mobile signal, but more recently I have been contacted by a number of constituents who have received parking fines of up to £100 even though they successfully paid for a ticket and did not stay longer than the specified time slot. This is simply unacceptable.

“The situation is having a detrimental impact on the reputation of Llangrannog and the local community, and I am also concerned about the impact it is having on local businesses, who are often having to face anger from citizens for a situation over which they have absolutely no control.

“I shall be pursuing this issue again with the British Parking Association as we cannot allow one of Ceredigion’s most cherished seaside villages to be torn apart like this.”

The British Parking Association said it would investigate all complaints received.

A spokeswoman for the association said: “Nobody likes receiving a parking ticket, but if a motorist does that they believe was issued in error they should appeal to the operator in the first instance. If it is rejected the operator will provide details of the independent appeals service POPLA, which provides independent redress for motorists.”

https://www.walesonline.co.uk/news/wales-news/llangrannog-car-park-fine-beach-20537396


 


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